Part 3/Final: Dialogue between a Catholic and a Mormon
(What began as a tense conversation about our views on religion, ended with respect for our differences. Alan and I call one another “friend”. I am thrilled to have friends of many different religions and views on life. I love all of God’s children. -Valerie)
Dear Alan,
Thank you so much! And that is truly wonderful you had that experience after you went to confession. I have had experiences similar to that…which helps me to know that God is real, and loves us more than we can possibly imagine.
I wish there was a way that all Christian religions could work together to bring more peace into the world. I know that many churches, including ours, do work together for humanitarian efforts, and they worked together to help pass Prop. 8 in California. It is heart-warming to think that although we may not agree on every point of doctrine, we do agree on many, many important aspects of life.
God Bless You Too, Alan, and your wife and your family!
Sincerely, Valerie
———————————————————————-
Dear Alan, Here is a recent article I thought you might like to read, it mentions the Catholic Church as well. I’ve underlined the parts I really love about this article, although I enjoyed the entire piece. Take Care! – Valerie 
“SALT LAKE CITY 18 April 2008. (Newsroom). A respect for the diverse beliefs and unique contributions of all the world’s faiths is one of the hallmarks of Mormonism. From the earliest days of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, Joseph Smith elevated the principle of religious liberty and tolerance: “We claim the privilege of worshiping Almighty God according to the dictates of our own conscience, and allow all men the same privilege, let them worship how, where, or what they may” (Articles of Faith 1:11).
In that same spirit, Church President Thomas S. Monson made a plea during general conference, a semiannual worldwide meeting, for more religious understanding: “I would encourage members of the Church wherever they may be to show kindness and respect for all people everywhere. The world in which we live is filled with diversity. We can and should demonstrate respect toward those whose beliefs differ from ours.” Latter-day Saints accept all sincere believers as equals in the pursuit of faith and in the great work of serving humanity.
Emphasizing God’s love for all people, not just those of one religion, President Dieter F. Uchtdorf of the First Presidency, the highest governing body of the Church, declared: “We honor and respect sincere souls from all religions, no matter where or when they lived, who have loved God, even without having the fullness of the gospel. We lift our voices in gratitude for their selflessness and courage. We embrace them as brothers and sisters, children of our Heavenly Father. … He hears the prayers of the humble and sincere of every nation, tongue, and people. He grants light to those who seek and honor Him and are willing to obey His commandments.”
The late Krister Stendahl, emeritus Lutheran Bishop of Stockholm and professor emeritus of Harvard Divinity School, established three rules for religious understanding: (1) When you are trying to understand another religion, you should ask the adherents of that religion and not its enemies; (2) don’t compare your best to their worst; and (3) leave room for “holy envy” by finding elements in other faiths to emulate. These principles foster relationships between religions that build trust and lay the groundwork for charitable efforts.
The spiritual and physical needs of the world require goodwill and cooperation among different faiths. Each of them makes a valuable contribution to the larger community of believers.
In the words of early Church apostle Orson F. Whitney, “God is using more than one people for the accomplishment of his great and marvelous work. The Latter-day Saints cannot do it all. It is too vast, too arduous, for any one people.” Thus, members of the Church do not view fellow believers around the world as adversaries or competitors, but as partners in the many causes for good in the world.
For example, the Church has joined forces with Catholic Relief Services in a “collaboration of caring” that aids victims of famine and natural disaster. Furthermore, the Church worked with Islamic Relief Worldwide and the Islamic Society of Great Salt Lake to provide immediate humanitarian assistance in December 2004 to the tsunami-hit areas of Indonesia, Thailand and Sri Lanka.
It is important to note that interfaith cooperation does not require doctrinal compromise. Though the Church asserts its ecclesiastical independence and recognizes its doctrinal differences, this does not prevent it from partnering with other faiths in charitable projects. These efforts are based on universal values. A different interpretation of the atonement of Christ, for example, need not diminish the mandate of Christ to “love thy neighbor as thyself.” Therefore, it is necessary to maintain a separation between charitable efforts and doctrinal tenets, while at the same time sharing mutual concern for those in need. People of good faith do not need to have the exact same beliefs in order to accomplish great things in the service of their fellow human beings.”
———————————————————————-
Hello Alan, I hope all is going well for you and your wife and loved ones. Again, I so much appreciate you sharing that truly miraculous experience you had. I’ve had spiritual experiences, but I have not had the privilege of witnessing Mary or her Son. If I did, I would cry tears of joy and immense gratitude. Below is our Christmas Email… including pictures of our little family. Take Care! Sincerely, Valerie Fulmer
——————————————————
Hi Valerie, Thank you so much for your e-mail with pictures of your beautiful family! I wish you a very Merry Christmas and a Happy and prosperous New Year. Above all may it be a healthy year for you and your loved ones. May God continue to love, guide and protect you.
God bless you and thank you for sharing your beliefs and spirituality with me. Isn’t it interesting how God uses each one of us to draw closer to Him. You came into my spiritual journey when I needed to learn to be more tolerant and respectful of all faiths. Thank you for helping me to grow spiritually. Peace and love, Alan
—————————————————————–
Pictures of Alan’s family sent via email, Subject line:Merry Christmas from my wife Patricia, son James and daughter Jessica and me.
——————————————————————-
Alan, Thank you so very much! You, too, have a beautiful family.
Have a Safe, Peaceful and Merry Christmas! Sincerely, Valerie ——————————————————–
Hello Alan, I hope all is going well for you and your family. I’ve been asked to be a blogger for the website www.moregoodfoundation.com (I think that’s the correct link). For my first piece, I thought about sharing the email dialogue you and I had over the last few months…to show members of the church (and others) how kindness and respect are so important. I would change your name to protect your privacy. I didn’t want to do this, though, without your permission. I will respect whatever you decide. Sincerely, Valerie
———————————————————-
Hi Valerie,
Please use whatever you want. I don’t mind if you use my name.
I hope you had a wonderful Christmas. May the New Year be filled with love and respect for one another. May God continue to pour out His Holy Spirit to each one of us. –Alan
——————————————————————–
Dialogue between a Catholic and a Mormon/ Part 2
Filed under: Basic Beliefs of Mormons, Netiquette & Correspondence, The Fall, The Garden of Eden
Continued from Part I…
Actually Valerie my wife used to be a mormon, she is now studying in RCIA to become a Catholic. Also my brother -in-law has been a mormon for over 25 years so I know about your faith. I know about your belief in eternal progression and your belief in the various stages of heaven. Also you believe that you can be like God and have your own world to have dominion over.
Harmony Mormon
There is no distinction between wanting to be like God (there is only one God not a plurality of Gods) and being a God. Eve didn’t have to be like God to understand that it was forbidden to eat of the fruit. GOD instructed her not to eat it. Faith in God is trusting Him and being obedient to His commandments. If we are living in God’s grace we surely don’t have to elevate ourselves to Godhood, and we shouldn’t, in order to comprehend His commandments. Rather we should live in true humility as Christ instructed us to do and as he humbled Himself in countless ways. –Alan
—————————————————-
Alan, That is good that you already know so much about our Faith. If you don’t mind me asking, what is RCIA? I grew up with my cousins who were all Catholic. We went to Mass with them each Christmas. I loved my Aunt, Uncle and Cousins. I still keep in touch with them.
Yes, you are right…Adam and Eve knew they were not supposed to take the fruit because God told them. They knowingly disobeyed. But it wasn’t until after they took the fruit that they became ashamed of their nakedness…hence, they were now able to tell right from wrong without being told. They became as God in knowing Right from Wrong. So again, they were not able to discern for themselves from right and wrong until after they disobeyed and took the fruit. You stated the following…”Faith in God is trusting Him and being obedient to His commandments. If we are living in God’s grace we surely don’t have to elelevate ourselves to Godhood, and we shouldn’t, in order to comprehend His comcommandmentsbsp;Rather we should live in true humility as Christ instructed us to do and as he humbled Himself in countless ways.” I agree with what you said!!!! We definitely need to be humble. Pride is one of the worst sins in the world. So I agree! None of us are elevated to Godhood here on earth. We aren’t even close to it!! But I can understand how non-members (or former members) would think that seeking the Celestial Kingdom (and someday way in the future achieving godhood) can appear the opposite of humility! Seeking Eternal Exaltation (Godhood) certainly looks to be the most prideful goal there is. But in our hearts and minds this is a righteous goal, and we believe some ways to be worthy of this goal is to be humble, teachable, and Christ-like here on earth. If we were seeking power the way some CEO’s and/or politicians seek power, then we would certainly be a prideful people. But again, we believe it to be a righteous goal…and one that Heavenly Father wants to bestow on ALL OF HIS CHILDREN. He wants all of His sons and daughters to have what He has….to have glory added upon our heads. And we, as mormons, want all of our brothers and sisters in Christ to have all that God can bless us with. We want everyone to be happy, in this life AND in the next. This is not pride, this is Christlike Love and Sincerity. If we were prideful we would not want to share what we know with others. If we were prideful we wouldn’t care about other people’s lives. When you find something that changes your life for the better, in miraculous ways, you want to share it with the whole world. Out of LOVE, not out of pride.
Can you see where I’m coming from? I enjoy hearing from you and getting a better perspective of what some people think of Mormons. Hope to hear from you soon. Take Care! Sincerely, Valerie
————————————————-
Hi Valerie,
RCIA is the Right of Catholic Initiation for Adults. Thank you for sharing your thoughts and beliefs with me. It is good that we do have some common ground in both our religious beliefs. I became close to one of the mormon missionaries when my wife was studying your faith.
Glad you keep in touch with your relatives. Thank you for the red roses. May God continue to guide, bless and protect you always.
————————————————————–
To Valerie, From Alan / You have received a YouTube Video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mhAyEZR4gUk
Fr. Corapi’s Conversion Story – Condensed Version
————————————————————
Hello Alan,
Thank you for your last email and for sending that wonderful YouTube Video. It was very touching and inspiring. I feel so blessed because I get to hear stories just like that from mormons, and from people of other faiths. The Lord, indeed, loves all of His children. I have seen the miracle of Faith in Jesus Christ in the lives of others and in my own life.
It is Satan that stirs the hearts of the people to contend with one another over doctrines of faith. I believe many of these people are just trying to sincerely help others to see their view of the correct religion, their view of the correct way to worship. And in their genuine interest and love for others, Satan likes to add fire and turn that love into arguing, and bad feelings.
I will always strive to not allow Satan to do such things to me. I love all of my brothers and sisters in Christ, regardless of their choice of religion. I love them even if they choose not to believe in God. Although my heart breaks for them, for they are denying so many blessings of life. But only the Lord God can judge them.
Thank you again for your kindness in sharing that beautiful video. Have a great day! Sincerely, Valerie
——————————————————–
Dear Alan, After you watch this short video, you may still disagree with the words that are spoken. But it is my hope you will see that mormons, like those of other faiths, genuinely believe what our religion teaches. We believe in our hearts and in our minds of the teachings of the church. But again, we also believe every person should have the right to choose what to believe and what not to believe.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dEuvNbyBQow
Sincerely, Valerie
——————————————————-
To Valerie, From Alan;
I agree with Mr Holland God continues to speak to all those who humbly ask for His guidance and in the Person of the Holy Spirit He comes to our aid whether we be Catholic, Protestant or mormon. Salvation is not just restricted to the Catholic or mormon faith but to all those who humbly seek and live in imitation of the words and deeds of Jesus. You are truly living your faith and you celebrate the dignity and sanctity of all life. I mean that sincerely Valerie. How much safer our world would be if it was filled with more people who share your religious traditions.
Shortly after my re-conversion to the Catholic church, after being brought back to my faith by the recitation of the Rosary by my Protestant wife, I went to confession. When I exited from the confessional I saw the most beautiful woman looking up to the crucifix above the Altar. I went to kneel down and say my prayers and when I looked back she was gone. I know in my heart she was the Virgin Mary directing me back to her Son.
Oh God come and send your Holy Spirit unto us all. Including those who doubt and those who do not believe. Open up the gates of your unending ocean of mercy to each one of us and speak within our hearts.
God Bless you, Alan
——————————————————
End of Part 2. Part 3 (and the final one) coming soon!
Dialogue between a Catholic and a Mormon From November 28, 2008 to December 29, 2008
Filed under: Basic Beliefs of Mormons, Netiquette & Correspondence, Sharing the Gospel
In November 2008, I received an email from someone who found my email address on a mormon website group page. Alan seemed to have had an unfavorable view of Mormons. But remembering the scriptures, “A soft answer turneth away wrath…” (Proverbs 15:1) I tried to be respectful of his views while explaining my religious views and defending my faith. Thankfully, over a rather short period of time, we came to a better understanding of one another. I am grateful to have a new friend. The following is PART I of our conversation. – Valerie J.Fulmer
************************************************************************************
Why do mormons believe that you can be like God and have dominion over your own world? How do you reconcile this when in the first Commandment God says you will love thy God with all your being and you will not have false Gods before me???????? –Alan
——————————-
Hi Alan, That is a great question. First of all, you are absolutely right. We should have no other Gods before us. We believe that can refer to anything that puts God last, or at least not first. Like, some people worship the lust for money, or they idolize celebrities, or they covet power, and the list goes on. It is our goal to always put the Lord first, and to strive to follow His commandments. In our hearts and in our minds, we believe we are worshipping the true and living God.
One day, far into the future, if we are found worthy, we can be made joint-heirs with the Lord. He wants to bless us more than we can comprehend. He loves us so very much. This is a humbling thought, and many of us feel that if we die today, we would not be worthy of this. We make mistakes, we don’t always follow the commandments like we know we should, but we try. And we repent.
But the Lord will always be our Lord, the Father of us all. Jesus Christ will always be our Savior. We will worship them forever and ever. I would be happy to continue emailing you in the spirit of love and understanding. Let us agree up front that we may agree to disagree. Does that make sense?
Have a great day! Sincerely, Valerie Fulmer
——————————————–
Hi Valerie, The redemptive action of God the Father in sending us the Word made flesh, His Son, our Lord Jesus Christ, was necessitated by Adam and Eve’s loss of God’s grace. When Eve ate of the apple from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, she was tempted by Satan. She knew it was wrong as God had forbidden them to eat of this fruit. They could have anything else in the Garden of Eden. She was seduced by the prince of lies…” Go ahead you can eat of this fruit, if you do you can become like God. Eve listened to Lucifer and death entered into all mankind and heaven was closed to all future generations. This was the genesis of original sin. We were in need of a Savior. Then through God’s love He sent His only son to die for our sins and reconcile us back to the Father thus opening up the bridge to Heaven.
There is only one God in three Devine persons, God the Father, God the Son, and the Holy Spirit; One God but 3 Divine Persons. It is one of the mysteries that the finite human mind can not fully comprehend. Human logic is deficient when we attempt to comprehend God’s immutable, omnipotence. If we attempt to define the Trinity in a plurality of Gods we get into polytheistic theology. If we believe, as the mormons do, that we can become like God, then we are no better than Adam and Eve and we would be perpetuating the great lie. –Alan
————————————-
Hi Alan, We believe that one of Satan’s tactics is to intertwine truth and lies together; he is the most devious of all creatures. He will tell 10 things, 9 truths interwoven with 1 lie. Or he’ll tell 10 things, 9 lies and 1 truth, and so on. This is one way how he manipulates God’s children. Satan said to Eve, “If you partake, you will become as the Gods, knowing good and evil, thus your eyes will be open.” This does not mean Eve wanted to be a God, this means she wanted to be LIKE the Gods, knowing Good and Evil. There is a difference here.
So Adam and Eve partook of the fruit and they were then aware of their nakedness, they became aware of good and evil, just as Satan said. (there is that little bit of truth mixed in with lies) But Satan also forgot to mention the other parts…that now they would die, and would be cast out of the garden. And because of Adam’s transgression, death would enter into the world. But this was all part of God’s Plan. This was why a Savior was needed.
Our Father in Heaven, Jesus Christ and the Holy Ghost are 3 separate personages, but all with ONE heart, ONE mind and the same goals and purposes. What we say about the One, we are referring to all 3. How we feel about one, we feel about all 3. The scriptures say that we, mankind, are to be as one. Not literally, but as one, like God the Father, The Son and The Holy Ghost are ONE. The scriptures also say, referring to man and wife, they are to become one flesh. This does not mean they will be the same person, but they, the man and wife, are to have ONE heart and ONE mind. They are to be unified. The scriptures say that we are to be unified, with one heart and one mind, in purpose and goals of righteousness.
Is it not a righteous desire to strive to be worthy of God’s blessings? Our Father in Heaven wants his children to have glory added upon their heads. He is a God of Love. You are right to say we have finite minds and cannot grasp all the wonder and mysterious of the Lord. If we strive to sincerely repent of our sins, making the Atonement of our Savior and part of our lives, and if we daily strive to make good choices, we may one day be worthy for all the Lord has in store for us, which is more wonderful than we can comprehend. We are not seeking power for power’s sake; we are seeking to live with our Heavenly Father again! We are striving to please our Lord; we are trying to follow His Commandments. We are hoping, praying and humbly seeking to fulfill our goals and be worthy to go to the Celestial Kingdom.
Humbly, your sister in Christ, Sincerely, Valerie Fulmer
(This dialogue continues….Part II to come soon)
Happiness is the Ultimate Treasure
Filed under: Finding joy within the gospel, Fruits of gospel living, Joy in our relationship with the Savior
The President of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints (or Mormon Church,) has a wonderful way with words. Long before he became our Prophet and Seer, I enjoyed listening—and learning—from this great man.
Twice a year Mormons enjoy a General Conference, during which time we are taught by the leaders of our Church—including our Prophet. In April of this year, President Thomas S. Monson gave a talk I thought you could benefit from.
President Monson taught us about “Treasure of Eternal Value” (Ensign, Apr 2008, 4–9.) He said that there are three key components to living your life worthy of “joy unspeakable and eternal happiness hereafter.”
Those three keys are:
1. Learn from the past.
2. Prepare for the future.
3. Live in the present.
Today, it is not popular to speak of God and His importance in our lives. However, there was a time when God shaped a man’s destiny—particularly for those men and women who settled the United States in their efforts to assert religious freedom for themselves and their children.
We are the blessed descendants of such people—whether we live in the United States or in regions around the world—our parents knew the value of God and sought to include Him in their lives.
We would do well to learn from their example and to strive to emulate it.
Learn from the past.
People have been trying, from time immemorial, to see into the future. Many have claimed they could, but most of us cannot. In lieu of sure knowledge, we must be prepared. Oftentimes that requires a sacrifice today, but if we will keep our sites on our goal, we’ll know the sacrifice is worth it.
Also, we must pray daily to our Father in Haven, who loves us, because He will guide us in the way we should go—he wants each of us to succeed in life and prayer will help us stay on the right path.
Prepare for the future.
Too often the old adage “Never put off until tomorrow what you can do today,” is ignored as we daydream of the past and long for the future. But doing so robs us of our today, and today is the only guarantee we have.
We should never take the blessings we enjoy today to be forgotten or taken for granted. Too often, those blessings take the form of loved ones who share our lives and friendship. Live in the moment and tell the ones you love how you feel—they will be blessed for it, and so will you.
Live in the present.
The Savior, Jesus Christ, said:
“Lay not up for yourselves treasures upon earth, where moth and rust doth corrupt, and where thieves break through and steal:
“But lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust doth corrupt, and where thieves do not break through nor steal:
“For where your treasure is, there will your heart be also” (Matthew 6:19.)
Think of these three components of pieces to a map that will guide you to the greatest treasure you could ever hope to find. Learn from the past, prepare for the future, and live for today. Remember God loves you. Be happy.